Election Rantings

[Triyun]

Rules expired today so time to blow off some steam...

WHAT THE FUCK?!!! Ok I am sorry but it just pisses me off everyone who votes on moral values say democrats are elitists and all these people in the middle of fucking North Dakota say we are weak on terrorism and if we didn't learn our lesson from September 11th. Is that so?

Ok first off, where did terrorists hit on September 11th, D.C. and NYC right. Those are the people that should be worried, isn't it odd, that the people who should be living in daily fear of a terrorist strike voted 80-90% for John Kerry? You'd think those people if they were so confident George Bush was going to keep them alive would vote for him. But they didn't, you know if you live in Montana I got great news for you, Dennis Kucinich could have become president and the department of defense would be replaced with a department of peace, it would not have comprimised your personal security, Al Qaeda wants to hit America's strong points not rural america, and as I'll come to later in the rant, your part of the same movement as islamism any way.

Now the reason for why people in the number one terrorist targets DID vote for John Kerry.

1. They have seen Bush cutting funding to fire fighters and other first responders.
2. I'm sorry to say this but its a fact, they are more cultured and educated in worldly affairs. You walk down the street in New York City you can meet with people all over the world, and many have travelled abroad. In DC and NYC you find the people who know their foriegn policy shit, not in Lincoln, Nebraska. These are the people who hear the fervor of anti-americanism, and who know that the US needs cooperation at least intelligence and extradition wise from other countries to keep them safe.
3. They have real journalism, the small town papers I've read are frankly biased as hell and poorly written. For example the paper where I live, George Wills is the most left of all the Op-Ed columnists and Editorial board as well as no grammar or spell checking for their writers. At the Washington Post or the Philedelphia Inquirer you have both sides in their Op-Ed and their Editorial Boards are centerists. The NY Times leans to the left true, but NY also has the Wall Street Journal and equally prestigous right leaning paper to balance it out. Since they get a divergence of opinion, these are the people who know *gasp* Saddam Hussein did not directly plan 9-11.

On the economy and dole programs, if your in a Red State for the most part, and you voted for Bush on these grounds, then your a big dumbass. The fact is, the Blue States generate a little over half the countries GDP and are much smaller in geographic area, not only that, the vast majority of paying for these programs falls on the blue states, and the Red States get the most aid by far. Basically we've been footing the bill for the Republican states.

On moral issues, your part of the world wide Revanche de Dieau movement, which is a religous revival that has started blossoming world wide after the cold war. With the exception of Europe and Japan, just about every part of the world is reverting more and more to religon. What are the characteristics of this, homophobia, retracting women's rights, and becoming more and more suspicious of foriegners among others. Congratulations, other members of this movement include, Islamist countries and organization, Hindu Nationalists, and Ultra-Slavophiles. You know what, banning gay marriage IS homophobic, the fact is homosexuality pretty much has been proven not to be a choice, the state should not look up or down on it, just as they shouldn't for heterosexual couples. By supporting gay marriage or at least civil unions your not saying its good or bad, your affording homosexual couples equal rights to married couples. About 20 years ago conservatives wanted no funding for AIDS research because gays were supposedly practicing sodomy with a dozen partners at once, well here's a chance to have them be more monogamous, it will halt the spread of AIDS for one, which btw, is back on the rise thankyou very much abstinence only education. This country conservatives say as supposedly proven in the Decleration of Independance was founded with acknowledging men were created. Well Thomas Jefferson who wrote it was an atheist it was only for style that that was in there. The bible a document that archeological evidence shows grossly exaggerates many things does not belong as a legislative guide, if you think that, the same passage that had practices against homosexuality also had rules against men having long hair, similar punishment. Biblical law is no better than Islamic Law which conservatives love to chide if followed by the old testament and much of the new. It is my opinion from reading them many times, Jesus in the gospels is far more in line with the progressive view of the world than the conservative. We tried Biblical Law we got the Salem Witch Trials. Also why is it that David and Ben aren't responsible enough to get married and make a decision affecting only their own lives but should be able to own automatic rifles with huge clips full of armor piercing shells. The last time I checked that really is only good for doing one thing, killing cops or soldiers. The common street thug is not sporting body armor. So apparently the so called, 'culture of life' you espouse is also a culture where anyone has the ability to go shoot up anywhere they wish. Furthermore, why does the right favor taking away rights to speech but not registering all guns. According to your view, the first amendment not the second amendment is one which were not entitled to. And back to the gay marriage thing, there aren't any gays in the mid west and south compared to the west coast and the north east. If its going to destroy society with marriage it would be there. Not places where many consider it going out of the mainstream for women to be the main bread winner for her family. In those places, hetero's and homo's exist together peaceably. It should say something to those who shouldn't be concerned with the issue, that is mind your own business its not hurting anyone live your lifestyle in Kansas we'll live ours here. Our way doesn't impede either lifestyle, yours does, who is elitist?

In conclusion, the right wing won this election by pulling out tons of their people, the progressives want everyone to be happy the conservatives don't and thats why they won. Its not that were not concerned about terrorism or religon, its just we have learned there's more than the head on bull headed approach to life of blow shit up and don't tolerate other viewpoints. If you look at everything always believing your smarter and you know better, never trying to see it from another viewpoint, your no better than the enemies of freedom. America last week basically voted in a majority to say we are better than everyone else and kiss the Christian rights ass. I fear for what will become of us in the next four years and hope the democrats will be skilled enough to hold the ultra-right back, before we start a war of civilizations and stamp out the more in my opinion enlightened elements of our own.

[DarkAries]

Well, there is some good that's coming out of this. Despite his "glorious victory", Bush is seriously hesitating to do anything short of blow up Fallujah, piss off the Sunni's, and get rid of the best singing voice he's got in his cabinet in exchange for a token Mexican guy...who just happens to be one of his corporate homeboys! Though he says otherwise, this was not a great victory, Bush knows it, American knows it, and thus we don't see conservatives dancing in the streets.

Cuz they'd get shot. By progressives with automatic rifles.

No, ah...

Aries honestly doesn't understand it. He's the worst president in the history of the job, we didn't elect him the first time, then, like idiots, we do second time around. Somebody tell Aries how that makes sense.

However, choice was established for a reason in this country, so if buying votes with fear and blood and Sieg Heil Neo-Con tactics works, fine. Aries refuses to support a country that will not rise up and forcibly vomit out those tactics. Not with his life, thank you very much.

To use the Japanese phrase, Shigata gai na. Aries is going to be saying that almost daily for the next four years. Shigata gai na, shigata gai na. It means nothing, it means nothing. And it doesn't anymore. Forget Bush. For-fucking-get him. Bush and American politics mean nothing anymore. If they're so committed to doing this or that, it's not worth Aries's screaming over anymore.

And the fissures created here are the beginning of the end. This is going to one day lead to civil war. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, maybe not even in our grandchildrens' day, but Aries is serious! This country is going to divide itself again, this time in a fight between Progressives and Conservatives. And it will be the end for one, or the other, or potentially both. So what.

Aries is in the heart of Bush's pocket...and you honestly wouldn't believe the number of people Aries meets and talks to who are actually pissed off at him, especially in the cities. Aries has taken up the practice of keying cars with Dubyuh stickers on them. So we didn't win the vote. So American politics no longer mean anything. Aries'll still resort to guerilla tactics and make Dubyuh's constituency miserable.

This country is going into a religion-driven downward spiral, and if the people want to go that way, fine. There're 191 more countries in the world that'll have Aries. The city of Canberra's looking really good right now.

Just don't expect Aries to bail you out when it's all over, or to fight for that flag anymore. America means nothing.

[Craze]

Hold the phone.

You realize that the reason someone gets elected is because of opinions? One viewpoint barely beat another in terms of its shear size, nothing new.

It's how this country revolves around. It seems people act as if this is 1865 all over again (or 1864, I'm not keen on dates.)

Look, the reason ya'll are pissed is because of you have different viewpoints, and just because you say it, doesn't mean everyone believes you:

Worst President = Extremely Debatable (some may say that JFK was one of our best, some may say he is one of our worst.)

Gun Control = Debatable. (1. Guns Kill People or 2. People Kill People (or in other words, it's the hand the pulls the trigger.))

Iraq = Enough varied debates to kill a third world country (no pun intended.) Liberals or others may condemn the war for there not being an economic or physicall threat to go to Iraq, while Republicans and others may see the war as bringing freedom to others that don't have it and taking out a man in power who was breaking rules, murdering many, etc. And that we are, a free country, giving the same free privalage to those who never had it. But all these opinions vary.

And the keying Bush cars, that only says you don't like their opinions and rather punish them for it, making a worse image upon yourself. And another thing, I don't really like the stereotype you portray Republicans to be all religious, when not everyone is.

Everybody was afraid of when Lincoln was elected, yet, even through his controversies, he got us through a war and reformed a broken country.

(I'm saying, who knows what Bush may do, for better or for worse. Only the future may tell.)

[NeoEllis]

Crazy, Lincon was one of the most progressive men of his time and was almost always willing to compromise. Bush is quite the opposite, so you can expect the opposite result.

[DarkAries]

Lincoln was also a visionary, and, for his time, was also a Liberal. Even after the Civil War started, nobody thought Lincoln would stand up and have the balls to actually declare African-Americans to be free beings.

Look, you can hardly fault Aries for lumping Republicans together as right-wing church-going God-fearing bible-whacking hypocritical Sieg-Heil homophobic inbred gun-toting homeboys. Because that's all we've GOT around here!! Aries know that there're saner Republicans, just ask Bush's token black guy, Colin Powell! Aries'd vote for him in an instant if he ran for President, regardless of who the other guy is! Aries would have done the same for McCain, but he decided he didn't want to stop Bush while he still had the chance, so there goes that.

Anyway.

Iraq: If we had been serious about it, if it was purely for humane purposes (which it wasn't. Remember, it was about Saddam having nuclear/biological/chemical capabilites. NEVER forget that.), we wouldn't have rushed into it. Afghanistan AND Bin Laden should have been secured first. Yeah, so Bin Laden's sneaky. Yeah, so he hides. Was that any excuse to pull US troops that would have been of much greater use finding him into Iraq, where we KNOW he wasn't? Iraq would have been just a very large mop-up action if Bin Laden had been done in first. And get used to hearing those arguements, it WAS a mistake and you will be hearing about it until the day you die.

Worst President: Yeah. Now it is. But when history comes back around, is Aries gonna be wrong?

Keying cars: Aries doesn't like their opinions, largely because of the fact that Aries gets them thrown in his face day after day, and those opinions are going to remove this country from its superpower status eventually. Yes, Aries knows, nothing lasts forever anyway. So what.

Gun control: Shigata gai na.

And Craze, circumstances dictate reality. Bush said what the future's gonna be. Four more years, more of the same.

So shigata gai na.

[Craze]

Mercenary said:

Lincoln was also a visionary, and, for his time, was also a Liberal. Even after the Civil War started, nobody thought Lincoln would stand up and have the balls to actually declare African-Americans to be free beings.

Look, you can hardly fault Aries for lumping Republicans together as right-wing church-going God-fearing bible-whacking hypocritical Sieg-Heil homophobic inbred gun-toting homeboys. Because that's all we've GOT around here!! Aries know that there're saner Republicans, just ask Bush's token black guy, Colin Powell! Aries'd vote for him in an instant if he ran for President, regardless of who the other guy is! Aries would have done the same for McCain, but he decided he didn't want to stop Bush while he still had the chance, so there goes that.

Anyway.

Iraq: If we had been serious about it, if it was purely for humane purposes (which it wasn't. Remember, it was about Saddam having nuclear/biological/chemical capabilites. NEVER forget that.), we wouldn't have rushed into it. Afghanistan AND Bin Laden should have been secured first. Yeah, so Bin Laden's sneaky. Yeah, so he hides. Was that any excuse to pull US troops that would have been of much greater use finding him into Iraq, where we KNOW he wasn't? Iraq would have been just a very large mop-up action if Bin Laden had been done in first. And get used to hearing those arguements, it WAS a mistake and you will be hearing about it until the day you die.

Worst President: Yeah. Now it is. But when history comes back around, is Aries gonna be wrong?

Keying cars: Aries doesn't like their opinions, largely because of the fact that Aries gets them thrown in his face day after day, and those opinions are going to remove this country from its superpower status eventually. Yes, Aries knows, nothing lasts forever anyway. So what.

Gun control: Shigata gai na.

And Craze, circumstances dictate reality. Bush said what the future's gonna be. Four more years, more of the same.

So shigata gai na.

Iraq:Yet, it IS your opinion. Some people don't look at how we got there, some look at what we can do.

Worst President: Your Opinion. Reagan = Debatable. Clinton = Debatable. You say history books, when the books don't even specify who's better or worse, they usually will show the influence of each president (that is if they show all of them) and/or their positive contributions.

And we're human, is what everything Bush says gonna happen? No. Is what everything you say going to happen? No.

( And plus, I can't debate thoroughly on all of the arguements because my debating ability is represented by the following inequality:

My debating skills < a pile of dung

[DarkAries]

Ohhh, just watch.

Aries'll go out and fulfill some of his own damn prophecies if he has to!

*grins.*

[Craze]

Mercenary said:

Ohhh, just watch.

Aries'll go out and fulfill some of his own damn prophecies if he has to!

*grins.*

I'll watch but all in all, it's only predictions.

(And, I'll probably decline from this arguement since I've said what I believe and there is really nothing else I can touch on.)

[Just a Memory]

screw based reasons to hate him, i just do...I, in my opinion just think that he's far to stubborn, won't even admit his mistakes, and President Chenney needs to just leave or somthing...whatever i'm looking into moving anyways

[Triyun]

You don't fight islamic religous fanatiscm with christian religous fanatiscm. I'm sorry it doesn't work. If you compare the two philosophies there not that different.

1. Everyone except us is going to hell.
2. We have a direct line of communication to an omnipotent God.
3. Science is evil.
4. Completely pervert the actual messages of their religous texts.
5. Teach religous canon as literalist absolute truth in schools.
6. Take away women's rights.
7. Promote capital punishment up the wazoo.
8. Dictate their morality to everyone and use demagoguery to stir up the less educated parts of society against any intellectualism.

I'm sorry I don't see a difference between the two.

[NeoEllis]

And we're human, is what everything Bush says gonna happen? No.

The danger may not be so much that the Bush Administration has been "screwing up" (that, of course, coming for their perspective), but rather that things are going more or less the why they would like it.

I believe that most of us have noticed a subdued struggle between the Traditional conservatives and the Neo- Conservatives within the Republican party as of late. We all know about the Traditional Conservatives, but who are these "Neo-Conservatives" exactly? Most of us will recognize them fiscally irresponsible, arrogant war mongers that got us into this whole mess -seeming to be the antithesis of both the Democrats and Traditional conservatives at once. But what is it that these Neo-Conservatives really want?


"To Starve the Beast", so they say.

One thing to remember about Neo-Conservative is that they are libertarians to the extreme; "The government is bad, period." Many of them believe that America was at it best in the times before the New Deal, the age of the Robber Barons.

"To Starve the Beast" is to essentially deprive the government of funds to the point that it must shut down nearly all of its social welfare programs (ie, Social Security, Medicare, unemployment pay, student loans, school funding, etc).

And just what has have the Republicans been doing in the past 25 years? Cutting social programs whenever possible; tax cuts for the rich following the Laffer's Curve -the ideology that if you cut taxes for the rich, they will produce more and government revue will increase, which has been proven false time and time again. Accept it, it's a fact (even Laffer himself said that the national economy would have to grow 7% a year in order for the theory to be at all effective, for comparison, 3% growth a year is considered healthy). It's estimated that 2/3 of the national debt is thanks to these tax cuts first employed by Regan.

And what else have they been up to? Let's not forget about sowing the seeds of war by supporting the likes of Osama bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and the Contras in the past. Just how many terrorist of the future are we bankrolling today?

How about building endless tanks and planes that we can barely use in warfare today and multibillion dollar missile defense systems that just don't work?

So here we are today. As odd as it seems coming from me, the Iraq War may very well have not just been about the oil. Sure it was a great bonus, but have you ever wondered just how we got so stuck in Iraq? Despite how much I always reviled the Bush Administration, I always wondered just how they could possibly get so stuck in Iraq (after all, they should at least be good at this sort of thing). The reason we didn't have an exit strategy? Because that was the point of entering such a war in the first place, to send load of money we don’t have. Now Bush is slashing taxes and fighting a war at the same time -something that has never been done in US history before- and the national debt is exploding. Just to keep ourselves afloat today, the government is borrowing huge sums of money form the Social Security fund, which sinks us in still deep debt (remember Al Gore’s “Lock Box”? He was talking about stopping said borrowing).

Now with control of the House, Senate, Executive Branch and soon, the judicial Branch, firmer than ever and poised to dismantle Social Security -using the fear of terrorism and homophobia as muscle, the Neo-Conservative seem prepared to push America into becoming a VERY different place in the next few years.

Remember that the Nazis did not take Germany in a true military coup, the people let it happen. Never, never believe that it can't happen here.


"Seig Heil!"

[Craze]

Triyun said:

You don't fight islamic religous fanatiscm with christian religous fanatiscm. I'm sorry it doesn't work. If you compare the two philosophies there not that different.

1. Everyone except us is going to hell.
2. We have a direct line of communication to an omnipotent God.
3. Science is evil.
4. Completely pervert the actual messages of their religous texts.
5. Teach religous canon as literalist absolute truth in schools.
6. Take away women's rights.
7. Promote capital punishment up the wazoo.
8. Dictate their morality to everyone and use demagoguery to stir up the less educated parts of society against any intellectualism.

I'm sorry I don't see a difference between the two.

However, those issues or rules were there for it's OWN time period, which means it was meant for that time period. The rules will change over time and it doesn't mean that it's modernly based for our own time period. (As I have been told, and how I see such rules in the Old Testament. They are symbolic but they can't necessarily be up to date as rules for our modern time.)

But, both religions have different interpretations, and different individuals have diffferent interpretations. That, the ones you stated, are your interpretations.

[Kensai]

Triyun said:

You don't fight islamic religous fanatiscm with christian religous fanatiscm. I'm sorry it doesn't work. If you compare the two philosophies there not that different.

1. Everyone except us is going to hell.
2. We have a direct line of communication to an omnipotent God.
3. Science is evil.
4. Completely pervert the actual messages of their religous texts.
5. Teach religous canon as literalist absolute truth in schools.
6. Take away women's rights.
7. Promote capital punishment up the wazoo.
8. Dictate their morality to everyone and use demagoguery to stir up the less educated parts of society against any intellectualism.

I'm sorry I don't see a difference between the two.

1 is true. The rest is utter bull. It's as if you didn't really study modern catholisism (which i believe is the more moderate of the christian religions). And about Lincoln. Lincoln was probably just as racist as any redneck hillbillie. After the civil war, he planned to deport all free black people in an ethnic cleansing. Want proof? Googles the words Lincoln and deporting.

*sighs*

I'm really dissapointed in you guys. It's a democracy. Grow up, and learn you can't always have your way. Hell if I could vote, i would've voted for Kerry, but that's how life is. We can't have it our way all the time. Let's just hope Bush doesn't screw up again.

[Wag - Now And Forever]

It's a little disheartening to see looking over not only the county breakdown of voting but the individual stats as well how the votes were laid down. Somthing like 80 some odd percent of the black population voted for Kerry. Like it or not, black people are a minority in America, even though in some cities (my hometown) they are a majority. The Democratic party is slowly but surely taking on the identity of the "champion of the oppressed" or "the party of the disenfranchised". Hispanics, Gays, African Americans, and others who feel neglected or left out of politics flock almost instictively to the democrats because of this fasod.

But what absolutely pissed me off the most during the whole election was this disgusting political activisim campaign everyone wanted to put on. "OMG GO OUT AND VOTE!" and "VOTE OR DIE!" or some bullshit like that. Yes, voting is important. Voting when you don't know a goddamn thing about either candidate[/b] is different. People who aren't satisfied with the current state of affairs immediately blame the incumbent, and vote the other way. In fact, it is likely that these same people who vote this way will vote for all members of the same party in their local elections, not even knowing anything besides the party that they represent.

While I consider myself a Republican, I am not so stupid as to say "All Democrats are poor leaders and politicians and all Republicans are good." Anyone who takes this stance should be killed by having a butterfly ballot shoved up their ass. It pisses me off when people who know shit about either candidate go to the polls and feel like "they did somthing" when all they accomplished was doing somthing Xibit or Britney Spears told them to do on MTV during an interruption in the broadcast telling them to "GO VOTE OR DIE!!!". If people always did what celebrities told them to do...well...God really help us all...

But back to the point - America has to get over this racial stigmata. I live in Atlana where a massive percentage of the population is black. A day hasn't gone by since I've moved here that I haven't seen a black person, and that's a good thing. Even though Georgia is a highly integrated state urban-wise, there still exist PLENTY of places where racial tensions are extremely high, even KKK-esque. And why? Because someone's parents told them it was right? This prepetuation of racisim through the generations has to stop.

And people say "Well Wag, blacks aren't the only ones. What about Asians and internment camps? How about how they got fucked over during World War II?? Etc...etc..."

Consider the last person you met who was a survivor of WW II. There aren't many left. More and more people are dying who actually participated in World War II and lived in that era. More and more people are forgetting Asian prejudice from over fifty years ago. Simply put, the generation is dying out. However, there are black people alive who still remember being kicked off of buses and hosed down at protests - and they aren't about to let their children forget it. The same is true for white parents who remember how they were "forced" to attend school with black children. While you may simply want to say "time will fix it", it won't. America as a whole needs to start fucking realizing that people living in this country as citizens are Americans. White people are not Americans. Black people are not Americans. We are all Americans. Stop drawing lines between "the black race" and "the white race" and start thinking about the Human race.

Racisim has to stay out of politics if we're going to get anything done, and right now it's doing a great job of totally fucking up the system.

So what am I saying? Get fucking informed, and make a true "independent decision". Someone told me the other day they voted for Kerry because they were afraid Bush would reinstate the draft. Last time I checked, the only person talking about the draft was Kerry. If you're Black, don't automatically think Republicans = Evil, and if you're White, don't ever think that Democrats are always bad.

I'm not going to even bother with posting about the election specifics simply because of my disgust with the worthless "voter activisim" which did nothing but clog the polls.

[Mega Raptor]

Ya know, in Nevada there was a proposition on the ballot to change the wording of part of our state constitution. The part in question says that 'no idiot or insane person may be allowed to vote'

Given that thought, the only reason I can explain some of the decisions made in my own state is that a lot of idiots were voting illegally.